our agriculturists fearful of becoming so too, he thought it would been more becoming not to have proposed this grant. He would not oppose the Speaker's leaving the chair, but felt it his duty to give his opinion, which was also that of his constituents.

Mr. W. Smith said, that an hon. member had expressed his belief, that his royal highness would secure to himself the respect and affection of the country from his mode of expending such grants. This sentiment, however, involved a most enormous mistake. He not only thought it would have been more consistent with good taste not to have brought forward this motion, but he very much lamented that any such sentiment should ever have been uttered. He lamented that any minister should endeavour to infuse into any branch of the royal family an opinion that he would not derive a much greater share of the respect and affection of the people of England, by refusing such a grant, than from any mode of expending it whatever. The virtue that secured respect to princes was a consideration for the distresses of the people. It was true that the 9,000l. per annum, divided amongst the starving population would be nothing. If that were any argument for taking such a sum out of their pockets, the broad principle would be established, that the more numerous were the miserable, the greater was the sum you could extort from them. He, however, objected to the grant upon theory, rather than upon practice. Were the sum ever so small, it was a cruel mockery to demand it of the country, when such a mass of its population were on the verge of starvation. He sincerely wished that his royal highness had somebody about him who dared to speak to him the language of common sense and of common honesty. He wished his royal highness possessed a faithful counsellor, who would prevail upon him to send a message to the House, expressive of gratitude for the generous intentions of the Commons, and of his resolution to refuse the grant. In the eyes of the whole nation, his royal highness would then stand upon more exalted ground, than if he were to receive ten times the sum in the best manner that parliament, or rather ministers, could give it. Neither the credit, the honour, nor the respect of the royal family, depended on what was vulgarly called its splendor. It would be magnanimity, it would be real

and lasting glory in his royal highness to refuse what the ministers had not the virtue to withhold. ongo

Mr. Leycester acknowledged that the distress in the manufacturing districts was great; and if he thought the present grant would take one farthing more from the pockets of the manufacturing popula tion, he would oppose it. But he feared no such result. From whence were the 9,000l. to be taken? From the sinking fund. And was it not better that that sum should go to his royal highness, by whom a part of it would be spent in charity, and the remainder in the purchase of articles of British manufacture, than that it should be devoted to purposes from which the people would gain no advantage? He thought the grant could be justified; first by the situation, and next by the conduct of the duke of Clarence. By his situation; because, though he was not what was, technically speaking, the herr apparent, yet he approached so near to the throne, that he could be considered in no other light. By his conduct he was intitled; and this grant was, in reality, but a proper tribute of respect from the people towards his royal highness, and an expres sion of their approbation of his conduct He spoke of the conduct of his royal high ness; because he was not one of those who were of opinion, that the conduct of princes was not a matter to be brought into discussions of this nature. siadt to

Mr. Monck thought, that if his hon. friend had proved any thing, he had proved too much; since, if the grant of 9,000l. per annum would be a benefit to the people, the amount of that benefit would be proportionably increased by a grant of 90,000l. For himself, he thought the present grant stood without foundation and support. The present question was not, whether the country could pay this additional sum, but whether necessity required it to be granted; and in this opi nion he but adopted the sentiments of Mr. Plunkett, who, in the year 1818, before he was Attorney-general for Ireland, opposed a grant of a similar nature, and stated at the time, that his opposition was not founded upon any question as to the power of the country, but upon his con viction that the grant was not necessary He now called on that learned gentleman to preserve his consistency, and to oppose the present grant. He thought this grant unconstitutional, and should therefore

oppose it; but he also considered it to be both unprecedented and unnecessary, since, in his opinion, the grant to the duke of York in 1792, was not a precedent for this measure, as that grant was made, not merely on a treaty of marriage between the parties, but on a treaty of alliance between the two countries; and in that instance, too, the princess of Prussia brought a large sum of money as her marriage portion.

Mr. Calcraft thought the grant was to be defended, both on the precedents of the duke of York and the princess Charlotte. In the latter instance, the House not only granted 60,000l. per annum, which was certainly a very large sum, but they added another sum of 60,000l. as an outfit. That grant was made in consideration of her being the heiress apparent; and now that the duke of Clarence was placed substantially in the same situation, he ought to have an increase of his income, in the same manner as other princes had had before him. If the people had a monarchical government, they must expect these calls to support, in a proper degree of splendor, the branches of the monarchy. The present grant, too, was so small in its amount, that he thought that, instead of being extravagant, it was most moderate. He was of opinion, that when royal personages thus changed their situations, they might not merely require an increase of their income, but an outfit; and from some circumstances of the life of an illustrious prince, it might be seen into what difficulties and embarrassments they fell, when they had to begin their expenses entirely upon their income, without assistance of some other sort.

Sir W. Plunkett said, he should only think it necessary to trouble the House with a single sentence, in consequence of an observation which had fallen from an

considered merely with respect to the power of the country, or if it was, then it would be decided at once; but with regard to the necessity of the grant. Now, he was of opinion, that the necessity in the present case could not be disputed, and that the duke of Clarence ought to be placed on the same footing as other heirs presumptive had been. He believed, that the people would be ready to acknowledge this necessity; and that each man would as willingly contribute his mite towards this grant as towards any other matter of public exigency.

Sir T. Acland said, that he too came under the animadversions from which the last speaker had vindicated himself. In 1818, he had voted as that right hon. gentleman had done. He thought, however, that there was a wide distinction between the present and the former circumstances of the royal duke. He was now next heir to the throne; and no economy could be more false or illiberal than that which would go to circumscribe his income.

Mr. Beaumont did not condemn the grant, so much as the breathless haste with which it had been submitted to parliament, and the want of sympathy with the distresses of the people, which it glaringly betrayed. There was no wish on his side of the House to drive the people to despair and madness; but the best mode of doing so would be for parliament to convince them that it had no sympathy whatever with their distress.

Mr. Alderman Wood contended, that the expense of this grant would, like the general expenses of the country, fall most heavily upon the lower classes. He was proceeding to detail his reasons for that opinion, when he was assailed by loud cries of "question." He made a short pause, and then turning round to one of

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have the question whenever you like, but it must not be till I please. You shall not put me down. I will not be placed in the situation in which an honourable colleague of mine has been placed by the intolerant spirit of the landed faction. I have never interrupted the House, nor given intentional pain to any man in it; and I would ask, whether it is either fair, or just, or parliamentary, that I should be thus assailed in the performance of what I consider my duty?" The hon. alderman concluded by observing, that he should

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attention of the House to the appointment of a Stipendiary Magistrate at the village of Kilmackthomas in the county of Waterford, under the provisions of the Constabulary act. He had been furnished with a petition with four hundred signatures upon this important subject, from the landed proprietors, freeholders, magistracy of the county of Waterford, assembled at a meeting convened by the high sheriff. They had not resorted parliament until they had in vain sought hearing and redress in that quarter upon which they had a most unquestionable claim to earnest attention. The facts were within a narrow compass, but the question was one of general importance; it was not a Waterford or an Irish question only, but it touched the rights and interests of the whole empire, and the stability of the constitution itself.

Sir R. Heron observed, that the hon. member for Devonshire had exhibited considerable warmth in denouncing what he was pleased to call false economy; but that hon. baronet had never come forward with any definition of what he considered true economy. He recollected the manner in which the hon. baronet generally voted on all questions of retrenchment, and he would, therefore, be obliged if he would point out to the House the true economy for which he would allow it vote. His hon. friend, the member for Wareham, had pointed to the grant made to the princess Charlotte and prince Leopold on their marriage, as a precedent which the House ought to follow on the present occasion. Now, it appeared to him at the time when that grant was made, that both the House and the country were in a very extravagant humour. The House had as yet exhibited no symptom of repentance; but the people, he believed, were in a different temper. Let the opinion of the people on that point be what it might, they considered the grant now proposed to be as unnecessary and as extravagant a grant as was ever submitted to parliament; and under that consideration he should certainly vote against it.

He therefore called upon the House to arrest, in the first instance, one of the most dangerous innovations one of the boldest attacks upon the pure administration of justice. In March, 1826, the late governor of Waterford called upon the magistracy to into consideration certain outrages at Kilmacthomas. Opinions were divided, and the magistrates separated into two parties, although both agreed that the disturbances arose out of the spirit generated by the eve of a general election. On the 3rd of April, the first intimation was given of the intention of the Irish government to appoint a resident Stipendiary magistrate. A meeting was held, and it was there carried by a small majority, approving of such a step; but the dissenting magistrates signed a protest, declaring that it was unnecessary, on account of the peaceful cha racter of the county, on which it was in

wards a letter was received from the right

House then went into the committee.

announcing that the appointment had been actually made. On the 12th of April a county meeting was held, and resolutions, strongly disapproving such a course, were agreed to; and a memorial, in which they were embodied, was presented to the lord

that

lieutenant, by the high sheriff of Waterford. An intimation was then the subject should be taken into immediate

consideration. Seven

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sident magistrates, for within four or five miles of Kilmacthomas there were many justices of the peace, ready at all times to discharge the duties imposed upon them by the commission. As matters now stood, the county was called upon to pay 8007. a-year for an individual to reside among them, whose interest it was, for the sake of keeping his place, to produce division and disturbance. The experiment tried at Kilmacthomas was dangerous and unconstitutional, and in opposition to the statutes of Edward 3rd, Richard 2nd, and Henry 5th and 6th, passed expressly to preserve the purity and independence of the magistracy. The 13th Richard 2nd provided, that justices of the peace should be chosen from men who were the most worthy, and of the best reputation, while the 18th Henry 6th declared, that no man should be a magistrate who was not possessed of a certain qualification. The only qualification now required was, that of pleasing the right hon. Secretary and the Lord-lieutenant, and political accordance was a strong ground of recommendation. Had there been no resident magistrate within fifty or sixty miles of Kilmacthomas, the case would have been quite different, and the appointment excusable; and as it was, it would have had some warrant if there had been any disturbances seriously calling for the interposition of the police. The only outrage at all deserving notice had occurred within the last fortnight, but that was not within thirty miles of Kilmacthomas. In order to put the House in possession of the necessary information upon this subject, he would move for a copy" Of the certificate of magistrates petitioning for, and of the memorial of the county of Waterford against, the appointment of a Stipendiary magistrate for the district of Kilmacthomas, in the county aforesaid."

as the government of Ireland, a public meeting, under the authority of the high sheriff, was held on the 14th of November, when the petition to parliament, with which e was intrusted, had been agreed to.Such were the brief facts, and the House would not fail to recollect, that the meeting of the 3rd of April, which took place at Dungarvon, was on the eve of a general election, in a county which it was known was to be contested. At such a time, when it became the Irish government to close its ears to all party representations, it had thought fit, listening to the representations of one party, and remaining deaf to the remonstrances of the other, to make the appointment of a Stipendiary magistrate, as a mere mockery of and satire upon the administration of justice. The object seemed to be, to counterbalance the popular feeling at Kilmacthomas. Had robberies, murders, the burning of houses and villages, the midnight seizure of arms, been committed in that district? No: and the House would hear with surprise and indignation, that at the moment chosen by the Irish government, the county had been free from every thing that could be fairly called disturbance. On the approach of a general election, no doubt there was a certain degree of excitement; some foolish old women, not certainly as wise and prudent as the right hon. Secretary (for Ireland, had furnished children with a few faggots for bonfires, and drums, and the abomination of penny trumpets were in request among the younger inhabitants; but only in two instances had the peace of the district been more seriously disturbed, than by these juvenile processioners. Even those two instances were deemed of too trifling a nature to need further inquiry; and the calendar afforded irrefragable testimony of the general tranquillity of the county. No doubt the right hon. Secretary would contrast the state of the county of Waterford at such a time, with the calm and quiet of the archiepiscopal borough of Armagh, which had the good fortune to have him for its representative. But such unanimity could not be expected in all parts of Ireland, and if the right hon. gentleman himself had never stood on the popular interest, the lord lieutenant, before he was exalted to the peerage, had had ad some experience of the violence of party feeling during a general election. It could not be said, that such an appointment was necessary from the want of reVOL. XVI.

Mr. Goulburn said, that after the manner in which the hon. member had arraigned the conduct of the Irish government in the particular instance alluded to, and after the efforts, not only of the hon. gentleman's argument, but of his humourwhich latter he could assure the hon. member he took in perfect good part-after all this he felt himself called upon to advert more particularly to the circumstances of the case, with a view to explain to the House, and vindicate from the aspersions which had been cast upon it, the course which the Irish government had, in this

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standing the present attack of the hon. member, that the marquis Wellester member, the attack of would still continue his feelings of regard and kindness towards him; uninfluenced by the course the hon. gentleman had on thisgct casion thought proper to adopt. The ques tion was,-Was the state of things in the county of Waterford misunderstood or misrepresented by the magistrates, when they applied to the Lord-lieutenant? and if not, was not the appointment which they recommended necessary? It was unnecessary to detail the state of the county in 1825: for any person in the ha bit of reading the public newspapers must know, that during the entire of the year preceding the late election, the whole of the county was in a state, of which in dividuals, who drew their ideas from the condition of this country, could happily have no conception. The animosity isting between the parties in Waterland was of a most serious nature, and such as could not but be calculated, if unchecked to injure the peace of the county. It was not confined, as the hon. gentleman would fain lead the House to imagine, to the blowing of penny trumpets, or the beating of two-penny drums: on the contrary, very serious alarm was excited. The hon. member might recollect, that in that part of the county in which his own property was situated, armed parties of twenty or thirty on each side assembled, and were only prevented from engaging in hostile contests by the prompt measures adopted for the preservation of the public tranquil lity. In the same neighbourhood an stance had occurred, in which a magise trate was obliged to order the police to at tend him, in order to assist him to distrain a tenant for non-payment of rent. Such was the state of things, that a magistrate in the ordinary discharge of his duty, res quired the police of the county to be called out, to enable him opposition he was likely to receive Would the House, after this, believe that nothing had occurred at Kilmacthomas beyond the

instance, thought it necessary to pursue. | He could not but say that the allegations not say that the of the hon. member appeared to him somewhat extraordinary. He had heard of governments being blamed for not adopting the necessary measures to suppress outrage when disturbances existed; and he had also heard governments arraigned for making use of unconstitutional measures for their suppression; but he believed this was the first time that a government had been ever called to account for applying measures which were pointed out by act of parliament, to the suppression and prevention of acts of violence arising, or likely to arise, in a moment of public excitement. The fact was, that the appointment of a Stipendiary magistrate had been recommended by the county magistrates assembled at quarter session. Was it improper that the lord-lieutenant of Ireland should take the recommendation into consideration? At the Waterford sessions, several of the magistrates determined to apply for the appointment of a Stipendiary magistrate for the district of Kilmacthomas; and, with their request, the lord-lieutenant thought proper to comply. The hon. member had said, that this appointment was made in reference to the approaching election for the county of Waterford, and with a view to favour one of the candidates; but he was sure the hon. gentleman would not have made such a statement if he knew any thing of the feelings or the principles which directed the policy of the noble lord at the head of the Irish government. Had the hon. member for a moment considered the measures (to say nothing of the character) of that distinguished nobleman, he must have arrived at a very different conclusion; and he now defied the hon. gentleman to bring forward the slightest proof of any one measure of the Irish government having been suggested by a wish to influence the election of one candidate or the other. Further, the hon. gentleman was the very last individual from whom he should have

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